Safety & Mental Health with Wes Wheeler

Todd (00:06)Safety in the workplace is critical at any job, but it's definitely tough to achieve on a job that involves construction. Job sites can be very dangerous and unpredictable environments, as well as the work being very taxing on the human body. I reached out to see if Wes Wheeler, NECA's executive director of safety, could discuss the state of safety in construction. It didn't take long.

for us to get to the topic of mental health in the area of construction within electricians, technicians, office, employees, and all. Wes shares his unique viewpoint on this important topic. Now, as always, when I discuss mental health on the show, I want to remind you of resources made for those working through challenging mental health issues. And remember that these resources are also for you who want to come alongside your loved ones and to support their journey through this. So here's a couple of resources. One,

There's the 988 Suicide and Crisis Lifeline, phone and text, or phone or text, which offers 24-7 access to trained crisis counselors who can help people experiencing mental health related distress. There's also the Crisis Text Line. You can text HELLO to 741-741. Every person who texts is connected with a crisis counselor who is trained to listen and offer sound advice 24-7.

Both these resources as of this recording are free and confidential. And again, if you're struggling with mental health or concerned for a loved one.

So Wes joined NECA in 2014 and has over 40 years of electrical experience. Prior to NECA, he was a safety consultant in his own business and has been a safety director and OSHA safety trainer for a large industrial-based electrical contractor in Florida. Wes is a qualified OSHA construction outreach instructor and has assisted in OSHA instructor classes for the Electrical Training Alliance. Wes has served in many capacities in his career from electrician, foreman,

Superintendent Estimator Project Manager to Safety Director and is a member of OSHA's Advisory Committee on Construction Safety and Health, ACCSH. Now, his credentials continue, but suffice to say, Wes knows and loves the construction world, specifically in the electrical space. So, welcome to Keeping the Lights On. I'm your host, Todd Reed, and on this podcast, I connect with the owners and pros

who design, build, and maintain our electrical, communications, and industrial world as we explore the best ways forward. Hey, real quick, while listening, take a moment to give the show a positive rating, to subscribe on your platform and on YouTube. It'll help us grow the show and get out to more people. Let's get into the show.

Wes (02:56)All right.

Todd (03:00)Well, Wes, we've talked about this before we interview, but I like to start out each episode with the meals that bring us together because meals are a good place to kind of get to know each other and relax, break bread, that sort of thing. So if I or the guests were to visit you in your hometown, where might you take us to eat?

Wes (03:17)Well, I mean, some of the places I have to say that in the DC area, um, central, which is a restaurant that's right there, actually a couple of blocks away from, from our office. Uh, since we found that place after we moved our offices to downtown DC, is, one of the, um, more, I mean, I've taken a lot of, I'm thinking a lot of my, my guests there because of the fact that it is convenient being downtown.

there's a restaurant that opened up a couple of years ago that, in Rockville area that, L tough is, you know, just basically, we enjoy that because it's, my, my wife's from Venezuela, so she likes Spanish food and everything else. So when they opened that up in Rockville, happened to be a friend, coworker and her husband. So it was like, Hey, it's nice to go back. But I mean, like I say, when you start talking about the small plates, it's really a perfect environment for conversations.

Todd (04:14)What's your favorite thing to get there or at Central?

Wes (04:18)Well, central, I'm going to have to say that I go back to the same thing each and every time. that's the spaghetti bowl of these. I don't know what it is, but I've had that at other places, but it is just absolutely, you know, they do the fried chicken there very well as you know. So it's got a quite a diverse, know, menu, but

Todd (04:36)No, that's interesting.

Wes (04:42)So it's got some French heritage, some French background and all the things that's here. His spaghetti bolognese is better than anywhere.

Todd (04:51)Wow. Yeah, that's I do like that at restaurants. So if it's a really good one, I'd probably order that. That'd be great. Awesome. Okay. Well, thanks for that. Those are two good recommendations and I need to get to DC. what are the top three safety concerns of electrical contractors at the moment?

Wes (05:07)What?

I mean, at the moment when you start looking at, if you're an electrical contractor, electrical safety has to be at one of the forefronts. It has to be one of the top three. When you start talking about, you know, the dangers inherently working around electricity, you got to make sure all workers are familiar and qualified, you know? And then you look at the other, and I like to use this as an example, the costliest injury that not only affects our electrical contractors, but really, and that's some of the soft tissue that the

ergonomics issues. But then when we get into, know, what is, what is the thing that this really everybody is focusing on right now? And I have to say that that really is the mental health aspect of going on because when

Some of the statistics have came out in recent years. We really do have a mental health issue that has to be addressed. And our electrical contractors are really starting to step up to play and raise the bar on what they're doing related to this mental health crisis that we're experiencing in construction industry.

Todd (06:10)Okay. Is that mental health challenge specific to ECs, electric contractors, or is it kind of a construction broadly?

Wes (06:19)think that, you

know, again, the mental health issue, the construction suicide, it is one that, you know, addresses all of the contractors in construction. So, I mean, it is something that's inherently available to cause grief with our workers. But it's still one of the things that, as electrical contractor, our workers are around a lot of other hazards. And if you start talking about mental health and you start talking about construction suicide, one of the aspects is, you know, the capabilities.

And you start thinking about somebody that may be thinking about attempting suicide and think about the energized electrical equipment, think about the things they are. the propensity that something could happen and something could go wrong where they could, you know, put themselves in a situation. It really is, has a greater impact on some electrical contractors in those situations.

Todd (07:08)And I recently did a show with a just interviewed her. So it's not live yet, but Dr. Sally Thomas-Minser, who you and not just you, many others brought her name up. So I talked to her a little bit about this, but I really wanted you on to kind of get your, know, insight perspective. How prevalent is mental health challenges in construction compared to other industries? You have any kind of ideas about that? Like where that stands?

Wes (07:32)There are a lot, I think, a higher percentage of challenges in construction. it's really, a lot of those are just the perceived challenges that show up. And we talk about, you know, how many workers and think about the sense that I'm a construction worker. means I'm lower skilled. That means that I'm a blue collar worker. I'm already looked upon as being sub par, sub level. Okay. And so that person may have a,

an attitude that they think that they're not up to speed for everybody else. So they're already at a challenge to overcome some of those. Hills that they have in life. So I think that when you start looking at construction industry and construction industry, again, is a very physical trait. And if you've been in construction all your life or, know, we wear our bodies out. mean, we're really, we look at where, you know, maybe I'm at, at this point in time in my career and other people are where they move into the office.

You know, and now they can use my brain compared to the muscle that I no longer have that I had years ago, but it's one of the things that sometimes those workers can't make that transition. Sometimes, you know, they're better in the field and they're more physical in the field. They just can't do that mental work. They can't do that other side. it, does, you know, at that point in time, make, somebody in construction and feel like, just can't do anything else. And I can't do this anymore.

Todd (08:58)Yeah, I mean, they get into construction, right, because oftentimes, not always, but because they like using their body. They like doing physical, know, tactical things as opposed to the mental book work or something.

Wes (09:12)Yeah.

And I will say that, when you start looking at construction industry as a whole, the mental aspect for the office worker is taking the stress home with you from the field worker, the physical toll that it takes on the body. And then the dependency on some of the over-the-counter medicines or the over-counter or prescription medications that you may get from a doctor you're seeing to kind of overcome the pain just so that I can get up and go to work the next day.

Todd (09:42)So you kind of mentioned this a little bit. well, you the first health safety issue you brought up was ergonomics. And that's wearing that's that's all wearing on the body, which eventually might wear to the mind. And so that's kind of interesting how they tie together.

Wes (09:54)they do tie together. And I think that that's where, you know, the ergonomics issue we're talking about is that's the beginning where you actually now have to start getting treatment for, you know, pain meds and other things that's going to take, take away some of those and make you able to go to work the next day. then the problem with that is as you get used to taking all these medications, now your body becomes dependent on it. And take, for instance, that if I have an injury, you know, and some of the statistics are saying there, if I

an injury and I'm taking an opioid or something to combat the pain for two weeks or three weeks or for 30 days, at the end of that 30 days, my body has become accustomed to it. We all know what withdrawals are like for some of the drug addicts that are out there and we see in society. So think about your body trying to come off of some of the opioids that you've gotten accustomed to using. That's where it really plays with the mental health side of it.

And I don't know, you know, from society issues, if you can't get what you want, then you start re, you know, looking for what are the ways that I can get this? I need this. can't survive without it. And it really leads you down a dark path.

Todd (11:10)Maybe what are some examples you can give of how mental health issues manifest in the construction industry? maybe thinking also a little bit, what I'm thinking about this question is this, how can maybe someone notice something? if, know, I might notice in West as we're working together, something.

Wes (11:26)I think that some of the guidelines or advice that we give people when we start talking about how do we sense when somebody is going through a crisis. mean, a lot of that is really can be demonstrated by their physical appearance, can be demonstrated by, here's a happy-go-lucky person that's really very outgoing, very energetic, always capable of doing their job. And then all of a sudden, they're very reserved, they're very set back.

Instead of being engaging in lunchtime or break time, you know, even being able to solve some of the day to day work that we do, when you start seeing that conflict within that person, then you just got to start thinking, what are the things that are going on in their lives? That's effective. And all too often people don't want to get involved. And that really is the time that you need to get involved to be a part of it. You know, to ask the questions and.

and get the help of the person that needs it.

Todd (12:27)Well, mean, certainly it could be awkward, right? If I were to bring up a question to you or something like, do you have any, like, don't know, suggestions on how to approach that? Like, how would I approach you if I thought you had, sorry to use you as an example.

Wes (12:42)to it. Okay, I'm going come to work. I got the same clothes I had on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, all Thursday. You can tell by my clothes and my appearance and I hate to say my smell, but I haven't had a bath in a week, you know, right here. And so you notice these changes in and you know, that's when you might come up and say, Hey, look, Wesley, is man, those are the same clothes you had on all week. Is everything all right? You know, and you know,

Is there anything I can do to help? know, and just start in a general conversation because most of the time what person needs is somebody to talk to. Yeah. Think about it when you do that, you know, and most people are willing to share. But if, if, you know, if I say, no, everything's fine and you walk away and you say, okay, I'm not going to get involved. It's one of the things that, that what is your intuition telling you? Yeah. What are the things that's telling you? And you say, Hey, I need to, you know,

I need to dig a little bit deeper here. I'm not gonna give up on the first pass here. And that's when you find, you you take time, but you know, my wife, we had problems and she kicked me out. I've been sleeping in my car and these are all closed. I haven't been able to get back in the house anymore. Hey, you know, and that starts the conversation. Once you get that person to open up.

That's already starting to actually help correct some of the issues and start the healing process.

Todd (14:09)Okay. Well, this gets me thinking about, so it's one thing for me to have a conversation with my coworker, but what are some initiatives that my company could implement to help support that discussion, support mental health of their construction workers?

Wes (14:24)Well, you know, that's a great question. And one of the things I'm going to say about that is many companies right now are getting involved in areas. What's the one area that affects everybody, especially construction workers, construction workers, financial concerns. You know, there are temporary layoffs, layoffs all the time. And if I'm not taught how to manage my money properly or how to save money or put money away for a rainy day, you know, I'm going to be more apt to be in these crisis all the time.

Right. As many companies are now looking at what can we do to help that person financial education, you provide them some education. Also, you know, and I will say that a lot of times companies, if they recognize or they're made aware of some of the issues to, be able to point them in the right direction with an EAP program, an employee assistance program is great. Or even to the sense of.

You know, getting into how about, know, you're having relationships, issues with your wife. mean, Hey, you need somebody to go with you to a counselor. need somebody to help. mean, they've actually offered, you know, some, some counseling services to people to help them kind of get there. So I have to commend a lot of the employers that are taking a proactive stance and getting involved in that way, because really that, that is the means to an end to be able to say, solve some of these issues that we're faced with.

Todd (15:53)One thing I haven't brought up is a lot of EC electricians, construction workers are kind of self-starters, pull yourself up by your bootstrap, tap with people, right? I can work through this.

Wes (16:07)Right. And that is the tough guy mentality, the tough person mentality. And that's the other thing that construction workers like to be. We like to be. And I resemble that I'm the go-to guy. I'm the troubleshooter. I'm the guy. I am the guy that they brought in to finish up jobs or to fix jobs or solve problems. Sure. And that's what we as construction workers want to be. We want to be that person to take care of all the issues. and in doing so.

We don't want to appear weak by saying, you either we can't do that or I need help in doing this or whatever. But that tough time mentality is, um, you know, uh, what a lot of times leads us down the path to the other side. And we've got to get past that.

Todd (16:51)What role can, we talked about the company, but is there a role that management can play in reducing the stigma around mental health issues in ECs? know, around that tough guy, tough girl image.

Wes (17:04)Well, I think one of things that the companies can do to kind of get past that is, is once again, being more conscious and being more realistic in their expectations. When I say being realistic in their expectations, you know, how many times have you heard somebody come onto a job? We got to get this job finished by Friday at 6 PM. No questions asked. You got to do what you got to do and you got to get it done. with that kind of pressure coming from a company or an executive in the company,

It puts additional stress and additional pressure. And all of sudden now I'm thinking about, got to get it finished by six. And it's really concentrating on my thoughts and I can't solve the problems. Right. moment. Yeah. To be able to achieve the, the, the 6 PM deadline that we have on Friday. So I think when companies actually start looking at, um, okay, this person needs this many people to get the project finished.

This person needs these tools and these resources in order to safely do the job. You know, I don't need to send them out there to do a job that's going to require a 12 foot, a frame ladder with only an eight foot, a frame ladder and say, Hey, you got to get the job done. And they're looking at those are the things that companies can plan for and not put those people in those positions that are high stress, highly dangerous. And think about the sense that, know,

I gotta get this done. I don't get it done, I'm going to lose my job.

Todd (18:31)So I just, right before you and I talked, I talked to Amanda King about communication gaps in the office and field. And one of things she brought up was debriefs. And like, so you could come, that could be something you talked about, like what were the challenges that maybe we put in your way, right? Cause like, well, you had eight foot ladders, we needed 12. That's interesting. That's cool.

Wes (18:51)Well, I'm to say, here, I'll put a plug in. We're doing actually a presentation that we developed with Sharon Lipinski, my brother, Keith Wheeler, and myself. It's the voice of the safety professional. And to that point, really is in preparation for this presentation, Sharon interviewed and did a survey of a lot of safety professionals over the world. And it's one of the things that...

to really get the buy-in and get the feedback from the office end of it and stuff like that. Being engaged with your senior leaders is really important. But one of the things that came back from one of the interviewees is every week when we have a company-wide meeting, safety is a part of it.

But the other thing is one of the vice presidents that was there for many years, he always asked the question, does safety have everything they need? What can we do to enhance safety? Because when you understand risk management, you understand the impact it has on the overall success of a company. And you put that as a priority, it really does kind of, it resonates with everybody. And think that that's, having him ask the question.

What can we do to help safety? What can we do to provide safety with the resources they need? What are we not doing? Who is not helping you? Let us know. We need to correct that action.

Todd (20:16)Yeah, some humility and all that for management helps, you know, just to hear the truth, sometimes not very comfortable. Are there some specific resources or programs that you have found effective in addressing mental health?

Wes (20:28)Well, there's a number of programs and I will say that since I was on ACOSH for two terms and we started addressing the mental health issue and getting some information and links added to the safety and health guidelines for construction, know, an OSHA publication. OSHA has signed on with American National.

you know, society for suicide prevention. Okay. So they've actually now have a website where they have created a lot of resources. Okay. myself, I've actually was, was fortunate enough to be appointed as a board of trustee for the construction industry alliance for suicide prevention. Okay. And the website that we have there for that is prevent construction, suicide.com. So I'm going to say that again, if you go to prevent construction, suicide.com.

What we have there is a plethora of safety talks of how to start the conversation. You know, if you're worried about how to start a conversation with somebody, we have that information there. We also have some other programs. We also have links to other like, you you mentioned Dr. Sally and I'm so grateful that I got to meet Dr. Sally a couple of years ago. I'm also so grateful that Dr. Sally was here at the NECA convention this year.

Todd (21:41)Yeah, I she was here.

Wes (21:43)He was here

on Friday and conducted a vital cog suicide prevention, train to trainer for Nika and our members. And so we had 15 people in the class that, basically attended the class to get their, their, their credentials for being able to go back to companies and teach this program to the employees, which I think is that's another way that companies get involved by sending people that can come back and bring that message to us. But I think that, you know, when you look at that,

Construction working minds is another company, another organization that you can actually, and Dr. Sally is a part of that. So you can look at that, but there's, there's so many more. mean, I think that one of the interesting ones that I've talked to over the past past year, the suicide issue here in construction, it's not unique to the United States. It's not unique to America. It is a worldwide. And when you start looking at percentages,

Mates in construction, mates in construction deals with suicide prevention.

in Australia. Okay. And their gentleman came over and spoke at some of the conferences earlier this year. And the interesting fact was a lot of the percentages that we see in the construction industry, suicide rates were mirrored by the percentages that were existing now in Australia. Wow. So that lets you know that we're not all along in this, but I'm just saying that

If you see that trend and you see that it is a worldwide and going back to the fact that we make such a big deal about fatalities on the job related to falls slips and trips and electrocutions and the stuff. yet five times as many people or more die by suicide in the construction industry than they actually do getting killed on the job.

Todd (23:36)Okay, that's terrible to hear, but I assume that would affect ocean numbers, Because those aren't going to be reported on.

Wes (23:40)It's gonna look at ocean numbers, but when you look at...

Yeah. Well, they're not, they're not going to be reported on. And the reason that is, because a lot of times a suicide may take place off the job. It's going to take place at home. may not be immediately connected to the work. Right. So, and when you look at suicide deaths by suicide, and you look at the falls, you know, a thousand people dying from falls, electrocutions struck by, and that

You know, we have a lot of publicity affecting our construction industry on you got to do better. OSHA says you got to do better. We got a heat issue. You got to do better. You got to do have more resources. You got to do more training. You know.

What do we do about driving and being on the road? Because those deaths that occur behind the wheel also don't fall into that category of the fatal four. Right. And they're reported by another agency. And you start looking at there. There are more deaths in accidents, driving accidents, transportation incidents. OK, there's more deaths in the construction side of suicide. So, you know, I think that that's really where in the past few years, our employers and in our

industries have really started to open their eyes that if we just put our head in the sand and we only focus on one thing, we're going to be leaving out. And it goes back to if we only focus on one thing, we're going to ignore the other hazards and we can't ignore the other hazards.

Todd (25:05)Yeah.

Right. Well, know you can construction has been working on this topic for a while and electricals as well. So that it's good that it's starting to get out there more and Dr. Sally speaks and there's more podcasts and I think I think Europe has similar numbers as us and I think there's people over there doing some work too. So the more talk the better.

So can you talk about any successful, I don't know, case studies or examples where maybe some mental health initiatives have in construction have led to positive changes?

Wes (25:43)Well, I think, you know, to talk about positive changes, most of the time is the engagement where we've seen some of the intangibles, the management managerial support, the programs that are being instituted by the companies. And a lot of that is can go back to some of just as simple as social activities. I mean, all too often. Our workers get up, they get dressed, they go to the job and they come home.

They don't interact. don't socialize. They don't do a lot of stuff. mean, when I started to trade, I hate to tell you 45 years ago, I mean, many, many years ago, we used to have a little bit more camaraderie on the job. we used to have a lot more activities. it just seems like with the advantage of cell phones and the advantage of internet, the advantage of email, you know, we don't have that social interaction. think where companies are seeing their most bang for the buck right now is

Hey, let's look if we need to have some social activities, let's go on a retreat or let's let's you know, let's have an event. Let's have a a.

you know, some sort of a cookout, let's have something that we can all get to. Maybe even let's include some of the family members. I know that there are many companies that, that from where I come from Jacksonville, at least annually, they try and do some sort of a picnic to where it engages not only the employees, but it also engages the employees' families. And if they can be brought into the discussion, if they can be brought into it, that helps smooth over some of the, we know in construction, there's going be separation.

A lot of times there's going be travel associated with it. But if a family can feel like, okay, I can put up with them being out of town for a little while while they're doing work or whatever and coming back. And we have resources to help that family while they're out of town working. And that's the other way to contract to do they actually provide some additional resources to these families, especially when the breadwinner is out of town doing something else. Right. They need to know that they're safe and secure.

Todd (27:42)Well, like military has that for military spouses support for that because that's a huge part of that business. That's fascinating. Well, this, you know, I always mentioned this. I don't know if I've ever brought it up here with someone in the industry is this and other contractor shows I go to are interesting because you see families here. Like I went to a marketing conference, know, you don't see families there or my wife's lighting, you know. And so when you tell people that they're like, why do kids go? like, well, because it's a family business. It's kind of the nature of the business. I think it's so cool. So that's interesting though that, I mean,

So just involves them and they get to see the work that they're doing. But the support you can give the spouses would be huge anyway.

Wes (28:18)No, is huge. I'll tell you, um, I, I worked for a company for 23 years prior to my own company and prior to coming to work for me. And I can tell you so many positive aspects about that company from the day I started until the day that I chose to leave and start my own business and do a couple of other things. But one of the things was.

At the holidays, it was a family event. We had Christmas party. wasn't just the employers in the office a lot of Back then when we were small enough and we were engaged enough, the families and you know, what does it feel like when your child goes and sits on Santa's lap and gets a gift at a Christmas party? Yeah. Think about how much impact that has for the kids and for the family and how the, how the worker feels like, Hey, I really am appreciated for what I do and look what they go out of her and above and do for my family.

Todd (29:07)Right. Yeah, that's fantastic. And so I always like to ask Wes at the end of the conversation by refocusing on the why of what we do. And I think I know what this is, but it'll be interesting to hear your answer. So what motivates you to do this day in and day out? And what keeps you excited and passionate about what you do?

Wes (29:26)I just this afternoon gave my presentation for mental health construction suicide prevention. And I think my passion to do this, especially in this aspect of my career and in this aspect of what I'm involved with now, is the personal connections, the personal losses, the things that happened to me. And when I do the presentations, mean,

If I want you to be open up with me as far as my conversation, I need to open up with you. I'm going to share you what my story is, what I've been through and the reason why it's so important for me.

I've lost loved ones. I've lost family members. I've lost, you know, people over the years. And I, you know, we look at mental illness or mental health issues and stuff like that. We all experience anxiety, depression, you know, whatever it is within our lives. And we go through that grief process. think that learning grief early on in your life is important because if you learn how to deal with it later on in life, you can. But when it comes to suicide prevention.

you know, and knowing the workers that I've worked with, knowing that I've been that have died by suicide, when I know the opioid overdose crisis that we have.

And I lost somebody that was very dear to me at one point in time that, when I found out that she had died from an overdose, it was tragic. And so if I can share my story and say to somebody else from experience in that going through my pain and telling them some of the things that they can do, Hey, if a person comes to your mind, don't wait, pick up the phone, call them. It's not, I'm going to send an email. I'm going send a text. Hey, if somebody came over your mind,

you're thinking about them and the chances are they may be thinking about you. How about picking up the phone and calling them and saying, hello, how you doing? I haven't talked to you in six months. I haven't talked to you in a year. Haven't talked to you in a couple of years. What's going on in your life?

Todd (31:18)Yeah, that's huge. That's one of my things I pass on to my kids. Like if someone pops in your head, there's a reason. And who knows? They might be like, nothing. I don't know. But there's something's going on there. So that's interesting. Anything else with that answer?

Wes (31:34)think,

like I say, it goes back to what, what's our why. And while I was voluntold to go into safety, I think, and you some of my presentations, we go into that many of us are voluntold into safety. Okay. But I will tell you that once you get into safety and you see the impact that you have on saving people's lives, on preventing injuries, on

Todd (31:43)Interesting, okay.

Wes (32:01)educating people to recognize and perform risk assessments and follow the rules when it comes to working with electric electricity and following the guidelines. You know, it is rewarding when I can walk away and know that I've had some impact on somebody that's from this point forward. They may not have done it the way they're supposed to beforehand, but then after my engagement with them, they're looking at it through my eyes and they understand the importance of why they got to do it the right way.

Todd (32:29)Yeah, great. Well, Wes, thank you so much. I know this is a busy time and I appreciate you coming in and busy show for you and appreciate you taking the time to sit here and share this. It's a very important topic for us to share with the audience.

Wes (32:41)say

thank you to Graybar. Graybar has been a great, a really great, premier partner for NECA for many years. and I will tell you that in my previous life as electrician and everything else like that, Graybar was right around the corner from my account that I had for many, many years. And I can tell you all the people at Graybar that treated us over the years, treated us right over the years. And we really do appreciate the support that Graybar gives NECA, the NECA contractors and the NECA personnel employees and stuff like that. anything we can do to

support Graybar and these efforts. We're glad to help, but thank you for all you do for NECA.

Todd (33:15)Well, thank you. I appreciate it.

my conversation with Wes Wheeler, NECA's Executive Director of Safety. You can connect with Wes and what he's working on by heading to the links in the show notes. A reminder of two free and confidential resources I like to bring up when I talk about mental health on the episode. These are for you if you're struggling with mental health or want to come alongside a loved one. There's the 988 Suicide and Crisis Lifeline, both phone and text, which offers 24-7 access to trained crisis counselors who can help people experiencing mental health.

related to stress or their loved ones. There's also the Crisis Text Line, text HELLO to 741-741. Every person who texts is connected with a crisis counselor who is trained to listen and offer sound advice 24-7. Hey, I would love to hear what programs you have to support your team's mental health or your experience with mental health and overcoming challenges. Please send me an email to podcast at graybar.com and tell me your story.

If you enjoyed this episode, you can help us grow the show by subscribing and leaving a five-star rating in your favorite podcast player and on YouTube. Thanks for listening to this episode of Keeping the Lights On. We'll see you next time.

What advice would you give to 18 year old Wes?

Wes (34:42)My advice to my 18 year old Wes was, would be, you know, really follow your passions. And, but in life, things work out for the best the way they were supposed to work out. And I think that, uh, looking back at my 18 year old self, there's a of things I wanted to do. Yeah. And ultimately, uh, if I had followed those initial dreams.

You know, they were dreams. Okay. I think that that's basically, I'd say stay the course you're doing. You're doing fine. I okay. I think that would be my advice to my 18 year old self.

Todd (35:20)Yeah.

That's good. Do you think 18 year old Wes would listen?

Wes (35:27)know if it was my dad talking to me, definitely would listen because I always had respect for him, but that's good. You know, I think that, you know, if I was talking to myself and was able to go back, I think that the 18 year old West would understand that I had his best interests at heart.

Todd (35:47)That's good. You sound like a very wise 18 year old.